Racism much harder to overcome than sexism

Some of the most powerful people in human history have been women. Do you realize that Elizabeth I and Queen Isabella were each the most powerful people in the world in their day? We've had plenty of female leaders: Thatcher in Britain, Angela Merkel in Germany, Kim Cambell in Canada, Golda Meir in Israel; even supposedly patriarichal muslim and South Asian countries like Pakistan, India, and Sri Lanka have all been ruled by women.  Some of the richest people in America are women including the wife and daughter of the late Sam Walton who each have TENS OF BILLIONS of dollars.  Women also live longer than men and spend much less time in jail.

Meanwhile a black person has never once been leader of a first world nation. Aside from Oprah, there's not a single black on Forbes list of the 400 richest Americans.  There's not a single black man to rank among the 400 richest Americans, but there are dozens and dozens of white women. There's virtually never been more than one black U.S. senator or governor at a single time.  Blacks are incarcertated at extremely high rates, and black men die about a decade and a half sooner than white women.

Also common sense dictates that sexism would be much less potent than racism. Men view women as their mothers, wives, daugheter, and sisters-in other words an extention of their gene pool, and thus extentions of themselves, and thus are very protective of them. But whites view blacks as members of the rival tribe and rival gene-pool, and that's one reason many sociobiologists believe racism is genetically hard-wired into us as an evolutionary strategy.

So while electing a woman would be a big step forward on the road to progressive change (all else being equal), electing a black would be a quantum leap.



Display:


This is speculation and opinion (none / 0)

not based on facts.


DON'T COUNT THE VOTES, DON'T COUNT THE VOTES.... Obama and the Obamaettes... spring 2008
by TeresaINPennsylvania on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 04:49:46 PM EST

Yeah, greenboy (2.00 / 1)

Use Teresa's facts next time.


by Bee on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 04:53:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Half of the people in history... (none / 0)

have been WOMEN.

This is supported by the facts..

Vive la difference


Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%
by architek on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 10:00:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Septimus Severus was emperor of the Roman Empire (none / 0)

Was Rome a 'first world' country?

I would argue that it was. At its time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Septimius_S everus


Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%
by architek on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 10:07:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is speculation and opinion (2.00 / 2)

There are plenty of facts. White women live a decade and a half long than black men. White women spend much less time in jail than white men. There are dozens and dozens of white women on Forbes list of the 400 richest Americans but not a single black man.  There have been plenty of female leaders of first world nations, but never a black.  How are those not facts?


by greenboy on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 04:55:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is speculation and opinion (2.00 / 1)

There have also been news reports regarding the access and reliability of medical treatments for black women as opposed to white women...  the mortality rate for black women is higher even when they see doctors at similar rates as white women.  They are still trying to figure out why...

It was on NBC news.


Like the nominee, don't like the nominee... Our nominee is still better than John McCain...
by JenKinFLA on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 05:10:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

The causes of the diseases of poverty (none / 0)

are many.. In America, poverty means REDUCED ACCESS TO MEDICAL CARE..it means dramatically increased job stress, it can also mean living in unsafe environments, environments with higher air and water pollution, mold, substandard housing, lead paint, toxic chemicals in poor neighborhoods, danger from crime, increased risks of rape, spousal abuse, increased risks of alcoholism and drug abuse, lower access to healthy food like vegetables and whole grains in stores...

Both poor whites and poor blacks have these problems but a lot of these problems hit black people harder than they do white people.. sometimes much harder.
But poor white people are catching up.

Poor people of African descent who come to the US have far fewer of quite a few of these problems... I think.. so some of these issues MUST be related to the particular situation of American blacks, living with discrimination from birth.

I think discrimination still very much exists and it kills people from the inside.


Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%
by architek on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 10:21:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The causes of the diseases of poverty (none / 0)

well...  I agree... but that is what made this story so intriguing...  The women that prompted the study were not poor.  They were middle class, with health insurance and adequate access to preventative medical care.


Like the nominee, don't like the nominee... Our nominee is still better than John McCain...
by JenKinFLA on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 10:40:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I agree with a great deal of your opinion (2.00 / 1)

but you can't equate first world nations as never having had a black person as leader, but they have had women. Most 'first world' nations are ethnically homogeneous or have been until very recently. Of course they would have women leaders before minority leaders.
by linc on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 04:57:05 PM EST

Many other developed nations have had women leader (none / 0)

Many of them have many times..

The US is way behind Europe on this one..


Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%
by architek on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 10:23:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (2.00 / 2)

I appreciate what you're trying to do, but this is just as stupid as the other little escapade on the rec list.


Hooray for John McCain!
by ragekage on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 05:00:20 PM EST

Let's not compare the two. (2.00 / 5)

It really isn't getting us anywhere. Why don't we just say racism and sexism are bad things and fight them both? (I know you're writing this in response to another diary, but still.)


Even John McCain lusts after teh engels.
by sricki on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 05:01:48 PM EST

Re: Let's not compare the two. (2.00 / 1)

mojo'd to the 10th power.


by Johnny Gentle Famous Crooner on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 05:04:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (2.00 / 0)

Thank you for the diary. This is the TRUTH. Those in here are using race to justify why HRC has failed.

She failed because she ran a terrible campaign and was against the superior candidate.

That's the trurh.


McCain: The Past, Obama: The Future
by KathyM on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 05:04:03 PM EST

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (2.00 / 3)

She hasn't failed. What are you talking about? She may very well still win the nomination.


by Little Otter on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 06:27:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (none / 0)

Interesting. How?


My candidate lost fair and square. So did yours. Get over it and let's kick McSame's ass!
by RLMcCauley on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 09:04:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (none / 0)

Please tell me how she will win. I would very interested.
If only for the comedy.
McCain: The Past, Obama: The Future
by KathyM on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 09:26:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (2.00 / 1)

Same way Obama will - by getting the majority of the delegates to vote for her. He's not going to convention with the required amount either. Both of them are going to have to try and flip the others. Both of them are entitled to do that. Both of them will do that.

That's why she is staying in until the end - if neither of them have the required amount, it's a whole new ball game. And one she is very much entitled to play.


by Little Otter on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 09:45:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (none / 0)

I don't get your point about people using race as the reason for "failure".  First of all she has not failed, and secondly noone is blaming it on race.  Noone has said that Obama is ahead because of his race.


by Scotch on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 08:05:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (none / 0)

My comments are coming from Hillary supporters like 'CMJALA' who are using diaries to attack Obama on baseless ground like race.
Prehaps you should ask your fellow HRC supporter why he is using race for HRC failed campaign.

''John Kerry supports Barack Obama.  Why? BECAUSE HE'S A BLACK MAN!!! classic

DON'T NOMINATE KERRY 2.0 ........WAKE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!''
http://www.mydd.com/story/2008/4/6/12574 2/8185


McCain: The Past, Obama: The Future
by KathyM on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 09:25:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (none / 0)

I have to agree with the other diarist on two points.  John Kerry ran an idiotic campaign, and says idiotic things to this day.  And Obama doesn't respond to anything fast. He trys to ignore it first, then explain it away secondly, and then more of the real story comes out later forcing him to face it.

Your rant about race being the reason for Hillary's so called failure, is ridiculous.  Did you look at the video?  Race wasn't mentioned in the diary until the video, and Kerry does infact say flat out that being african american is what qualifies Obama for the job in foriegn relations, especially working with muslims.  If that isn't the most assinine statement from Kerry then I don't know what is.  Blame Obama supporters for the race mime.  It was coming right out of Kerry's mouth as I was watching him speak.  Unbelievable.


by Scotch on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 09:40:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (2.00 / 1)

Other than Alberta Fujimori former president of Peru, I can't think of a racial minority who was democratically elected to the highest office of their native country. (I don't consider South Africa before 1989 as being democratic).

That said, the question is whether racism or sexism is easier to overcome. The question is not which is deeper, worse or the bigger problem. Sometimes, we tackle the bigger problems before the smaller problems.

Racism and sexism may also be expressed differently. For example, Blacks may have a tougher time becoming a CEO of a large company than a white woman(Which appears to be true)but domestic abuse against women may be more prevalent than against men. So the comparisons may not be so easy.


Dizzy Zzyzzy
by Zzyzzy on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 05:05:05 PM EST

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (none / 0)

Well the most universal measures of success are money and longevity, and white women do far better than black men on both metrics. They live about a decade and a half longer than black men, and they have far more money whether measured by individual net-worth, and especially by house-hold net-worth (because white women live in the same homes as white men).

Also common sense dictates that sexism would be much less potent than racism.  Men view women as their mothers, wives, daugheter, and sisters-in other words an extention of their gene pool, and thus extentions of themselves, and thus are very protective of them. But whites view blacks as members of the rival tribe and rival gene-pool, and that's one reason many sociobiologists believe racism is genetically hard-wired into us as an evolutionary strategy.


by greenboy on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 05:13:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Both sexism and racism are wrong (2.00 / 4)

Both are wrong.  Both need to be stopped.  Both manifest themselves in different but insidious ways.

To say that one great evil is greater than another misses the point that they are both very evil.

That is like saying we should stop this genocide in country X because 4000000 people will die but not stop that genocide in country Y because only 3500000 will die.

Both are bad!

(note this comment is from a white middle class derived male)


Student Guy=JoeMentum. No really Student Guy=JoeMentum, after all JoeMentum was an embarrassment so is Student Guy. This sig is FAIL!!
by Student Guy on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 05:35:57 PM EST

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (none / 0)

Women are over half of the world population.  The number of women who have held a position of power such as you describe is pitiful in comparison.  In most 1st world countries, black people do not have the representation that would assure that they have an even chance at being elected to a high office. I believe that in the US it is something like 12 percent of people are AA. Beside the fact that I am not sure that South Africa is not a first world country, however you are defining it.  Is the prime minister there not black? If you are calling European or western countries 1st world, then it goes to figure that there would be less chance of a black president in those countries.  


by Scotch on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 08:03:07 PM EST

Before the Bronze Age.. (none / 0)

there is a good chance that most societies in the indo-european orbit were matriarchical..

This seems to be verified by the earliest ancient egyptian writings that survive...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matriarchy

The end of the Ice Age in both Europe and the Americas was followed by a long period during which humans lived in hunter-gatherer societies   which for quite a time lived in relative abundance compared to the more recent historical period.

Nutrition was better, and people ate more meat than they did until very recently. They probably had more free time. Indications are that most societies were matriarchical and matrilineal.

What changed things? Agriculture? Overpopulation?
Understanding of reproduction?

nobody knows..


Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%
by architek on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 10:38:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Sorry, but (none / 0)

this is as unhelpful as that other diary. Racism and sexism work in different ways, and any comparison as to their respective impact is inherently demeaning to the victims of either.

But of course, your diary is not going to rise to the top of the rec list like the other one, a fact which makes me cringe.


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 08:30:46 PM EST

Just about every statistic (none / 0)

supports the fact that racism is embedded in our society to a greater extent than sexism even if sexist words are more commonly used.


My candidate lost fair and square. So did yours. Get over it and let's kick McSame's ass!
by RLMcCauley on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 09:03:54 PM EST

Re: Just about every statistic (none / 0)

When you compare white women to minority men I mean. Minority women get the shaft when it comes to wages.


My candidate lost fair and square. So did yours. Get over it and let's kick McSame's ass!
by RLMcCauley on Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 09:05:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Racism much harder to overcome than sexism (none / 0)

With all due respect, I disagree with your diary.

Women make up more than half the world and make up 54% of the U.S. voting public. Afrian Americans make up about 19% of the votes in America and while I do not know the actual numbers worldwide - it is not over half the planet.

Women (and children) are the victims of more crimes in the U.S. and worldwide.

Both racism and sexism are difficult to overcome. But to state that it is more of a quantum leap having an african american for pres than a woman is simply ignoring half the planet.


by nikkid on Mon Apr 07, 2008 at 12:19:00 AM EST


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